WindyNation's Complete Wind Turbine

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by windyguru, Jul 27, 2010.

  1. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

  2. BeachBum

    BeachBum WindyNation Engineer

    Great videos. A few questions: Did you guys come up with a price yet? What size pipe are you suggesting it be mounted on? How will it incorporate the slip ring? Thanks, BeachBum
     
  3. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    Yeah, I do have a pretty good idea of what the price will be. It is going to be around 625 +/- 5%.

    The final version has a 4.5 inch long pipe that extends above the base of the mount. This is where the slip ring will be.

    The final version also has a 6 inch long 2 inch inner diameter pipe that comes out the bottom of the mount. This is designed to slide right over a 1.5 inch schedule 80 pipe (The outer diameter of a 1.5 inch schedule 80 pipe is 1.90 inches). There will be a self lubricating bushing that "sits" in between the tower and the bottom of the turbine mount. This prevents metal to metal rubbing of the tower pipe and the bottom of the turbine mount.

    Hope that makes sense.
     
  4. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Josh, great video on the furling.
    Your amp meter, please send me more info on it please.
    Are they available on Ebay. I live approx 250 km till I reach an electrical supply area.
    Found it interesting that you were reading DC amps. I always thought that you would get a feedback reading of amps stored from the bank.
    What wind speed did you need to reach until usable amps were being produced ? ( I understand this might change due to you using a fully charged bank at 27 V )
    The furling tail, what modifications would be required to mount the 750 on it due to the increase in turbine weight.
    On the new package promotion deals you are offering, will you also provide that for the 3 new 750's I have ordered ?
    Do the new complete packages come with a slip ring also ?
    Better not ask too much or you will forget the 1st question.
    Have a good day !

    murray
     
  5. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    Hi Murray,

    That Fluke meter is fairly expensive. It is very accurate and extemely reliable. Here is one on ebay I found:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/FLUKE-336-Clamp-Met ... 335f484965

    New I think they cost around 275 bucks!

    Here is a much cheaper version I found on ebay but I must say I know nothing about it. My guess is that it should easily be able to read the DC current within +/- 7%. And that is plenty accurate for what you want to do.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/Auto-AC-DC-400A-Dig ... 8946593633

    These are nice because you do not need to splice in a shunt or anything. No wire cutting at all. Just place the wire in the hole by opening up the clamp.

    You do not see back current from the battery because the current in the battery has nowhere to go. There are diodes in the bridge rectifier which prevent the current from going from the battery to the generator.
     
  6. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    The turbine starts charging a 24 volt battery bank at around 7-8 mph. The reason it does not start charging at a lower mph in the video is because I am accelerating so fast. It takes a while for the blades to pick-up speed and equilibriate their rpm. But if I were to drive a long at 8 mph for 30 seconds, you would see amps going to the battery.

    I think it will be fairly simple to adjust the tail to the 750. We will just need to add some weight. Not much at all. Probably about one/two pounds. I can have some stainless steel bar stock machined to bolt onto the tail support (the thing that looks like a "Y" and the actual tail bolts to it).

    We can work out a price for the three 750's. It will be way below retail for you and beachbum. I just hope that nobody else asks for a 750 because you guys bought 4 of the 5 I ordered. And I need one for testing.

    Yes, the new complete turbine does include a slip ring.

    Hopefully I answered all your questions. Maybe I forgot one?
     
  7. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    Oh, what do you guys think:

    Should the mount be powder coated black or powder coated orange? We can also offer the mount in both colors so the customer can choose black or orange.

    I just wonder if anybody would want an orange turbine? 10% of customers?

    The company that is manufacturing our mounts has another product they make which they powder coat orange. They could powder coat some of the mounts orange for about the same price as black by throwing our mounts in with this product. Otherwise, it costs a lot more.

    Black is their standard color which they use on everything. Because they do large runs of black parts, it is the most economical.
     
  8. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Powder coat : Black is beautiful
    Thanks for the info on the amp meter, will check it out tonight.
    Makes sense now on your accelerating / wind speed and amps showing.
    If someone else asks for a 750 I will give up one of mine,, IF you can get me a 1000.
    Need to test one sooner or later Josh.
    UTube Video, you did a good job.

    murray
     
  9. BeachBum

    BeachBum WindyNation Engineer

    Since you're asking us for our opinion, I would pick one cost effective color and stick with that one. When you start giving customers color options, you end up shelving inventory to please only a small percentage of you clients. I've found that black is the easiest color to touch up, even over powdercoating. Where I live EVERYTHING rusts, and we use a lot of Rustoleum products. Galvanized steel lasts better than powdercoat in a marine environment. Stainless steal and Aluminum is best, but Wow would that be an expensive frame! I vote Black. If others want custom colors they can always paint it themselves. Save yourself the headache.
    Thanks for including me in on the 750. Are you recommending the 5 blade wind grabber with that unit? How high do you think I can go with 1.5" schedule 80 without guy-wires? I was considering 2" Schedule 80 for my tower.
    Thanks, BeachBum
     
  10. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Thanks on the answers & links Josh..
    Bought the amp meter from the Ebay link last night.

    SO when can I expect delivery of a 1000 watt turbine. You might as well do it, I have been bugging you for about a year and I will not let you rest till it happens. ( Would be a good time to ask them to put one together for you when the 750's are being done) I think !

    In your other link you mentioned you are working so hard and not to rely on your suggested delivery dates on new items.
    That response is not good enough, tell your sister we expect her to work harder or start doing double shifts, the customer is always right !

    have a good day
    murray
     
  11. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    Murray,

    I will start to work on it once this turbine is out. I have some conceptual designs done and I also have all the math/physics worked out for the furling. It is going to take a while to prototype a larger turbine. This thing will have about a 10 foot diameter blade set. It is gonna be big.

    If we could deliver an American made 1000 Watt wind turbine for under 1000 dollars, that would be cool!
     
  12. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    Beachbum,

    I got no idea how high you could go with 1.5 inch schedule 80 without guy wires. I would like to say 12-15 feet if the other end of the pipe was MANY feet in the ground but I can't as our company lawyer would yell at me. Ask Murray to e-mail you some pics he has of his old WindBlue with the WindGrabbers getting hit by a very intense wind storm (Or better yet, maybe Murray can post the pictures here?). Pretty amazing what happenend! Is there a reason you can not use guy wires? And yes, the 5-blade WindGrabber should pair nicely with the 750.

    The cost for the orange and the black is the same price. But, I do appreciate your point about sticking with one color.

    We could do a "marine grade" version by building the mount out of 100% stainless steel and the blades and tail would be marine grade aluminum. This would add about 100 dollars to the unit. Hell, we could even use stainless steel bearings inside the generator. If there is a market for that, then we could easily do it. From a fabrication perspective, nothing changes. We would just need to swap steel for stainless steel.
     
  13. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Beach: I have attached the photo I believe Josh was referring too. This was a 10 ft section of 1 1/2 inch on top of 20 ft of 2 inch.
    You can see the power that is created even with guide wires. In this case we new a micro burst storm had hit us within an already violent wind.
    No hard evidence but it was also suggested that the pipe was curled due to the lift force the blades created. This was a set of windgrabbers we were testing on a Windblue turbine. The darn thing was still spinning the next morning and creating usable V. This was my version of furling

    My very fist tower was a 20 ft at 1 1/2 inch pipe. At 20 ft I already had to have it guide wired or it would not have lasted its first day. If I was using a larger diameter pipe for my tower like a 2 inch or 3inch and I needed to have a 1 1/2 inch on the top to accommodate a turbine mount I would only use a short nipple of 1 1/2 in to weld it in solid to my main tower and have just enough protruding to set the mount on.

    As soon as I started to increase my tower heights there was the need for a double set of wires. The top set of wires were critical, they take most of the force, the 2nd lower set helps stabilize.

    Now I would never put up a tower without the guide wires just from the experience that you can never know what nature is going to send your way in the amount of wind.

    Now you have brought something up that I was thinking about. The new Windy mounts will slip over a 1 1/2 inch pipe. That is ok if your tower is that size but it does create more work if your tower size is larger.

    Josh, could there be any options to the mount pipe if your tower is a larger size pipe.

    [attachment=0:1a6cfhy1]still spinning.JPG[/attachment:1a6cfhy1]
     

    Attached Files:

  14. BeachBum

    BeachBum WindyNation Engineer

    Here's the problem: First, because I live at the beach I am controlled by every agency in the country. I can't leave my lights visible to the ocean because I'm in a turtle nesting area and my house is directly adjacent to a state park. I am not allowed to cut the vegetation or construct anything past an invisible line in the sand on my own property. I'm not even allowed to walk on my own dune that I pay property tax on, or pick my own sea oats that I planted on my own property or I could get arrested. It's absurd the Bull@*#t laws and rules that we tolerate here at the beach. I don't even live in a subdivision, where the rules are worse. I absolutely agree that guy wires would be the best, but guy wires are not really an option for me because it would mean that I would be breaking the law based on where I would need to place the anchors on my property to be effective. I was considering some kind of beefy galvanized monopole or attaching the tower to my house with some vibration dampeners.
    Second issue: To stainless or not to stainless, that is the question. I would be sooooooooooooooooooo happy to pay an extra $100. to have an all stainless and aluminum wind turbine. Here in Florida, the only decent wind is at the beach. If you look at any wind map. It shows the interior of Florida as a terrible wind producer, but we have about 1,200 miles of oceanfront with reasonable winds especially in the winter months. Josh, you could sell a boat load of "marine grade" units here on the Florida coast. You know my address from when I purchased my Windy 500. Look on Google Earth at my house, to get an idea of the wind my neighbors and I get. Then I will ask you this question. Once my PMA goes up, all my neighbors are going to want one. Would you consider making me your first authorized distributor of the Complete Wind Turbines, once they're finished? Think about it, and please reply in a personal email.
    Finally, a thought about frame materials. Many years ago a very well respected elderly Jewish businessman, and friend of our family shared with me a secret that I've found to be true. He said, "It only costs a little more to offer your customers the very best." This is so true because it sets you apart from the rest of the herd. People recognize quality, and are will to pay a little more to get it. We know names like Rolex, Tiffanys, and Cadillac. All these companys are know for providing the very best. Since you have a sealed all stainless and aluminum PMA, tail, and blade set, you could consider a stainless frame if the cost was really that similar. You would be offering a truely unique product that would set your company strides beyond the competition. Once you set up your production for stainless only, your costs would drop significantly over time, versus a random "marine grade" build. Call me if you like, and I'll discuss these topics with you more. You have my phone number, or email me directly if you prefer.
    Very sincerely, BeachBum
     
  15. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Beach, are you sure it is legal to actually put up an wind tower ?

    murray
     
  16. BeachBum

    BeachBum WindyNation Engineer

    Yes, I've had several conversations with our county Building and Zoning Department Officials. Wind Turbines are permitted under a "special use provision". Our county seems very receptive to the idea of alternative energy concepts, and many homes use solar power panels here because of our abundant sunshine. As for wind, there is not any specific zoning as of yet, but it is "in the works" in my county because some people have already installed Moriah turbines in the county north of me. There are maybe 10 Skystreams in my state, but they are no longer selling the 33.5 tower. They will only sell their unit with their towers 45 feet or higher. The problem is we have a 35 foot building height restriction in my county. If you wish to go higher than that you need a "variance". At the beach we must build rearward of the invisible "coastal construction line" I refered to earlier. I'm told that the Moriah turbine falls under the less than 35' guideline, and is considered by the county as a "UL approved electric generator". I don't know if there are any plans to for the Windy units to become UL approved, but it is an issue that needs to be overcome to legally connect to the grid in Florida. This goes for inverter requirements also. You can use a wind turbine to charge batteries, appliances, electric cars, etc. so long as you are not integrated with your house grid. Most of the stuff I've seen here are much smaller Air-X type units, more for decoration than anything.
    BeachBum
     
  17. offgridsomeday

    offgridsomeday WindyNation Engineer

    Wow, the picture of that tower and turbine bent over really has me questioning my tower height increase without wires. Ive climed to the top and it seems pretty stable but man that picture is a little scary. I will just have to keep an eye on it and hope for the best for now. Supposed to have 14 mph tomarrow so I will be watching it closley all day for any swaying and I will report back. Any idea what wind speed that thing was encountering? Talk to you all tomorrow.


    offgridsomeday
     
  18. BeachBum

    BeachBum WindyNation Engineer

    Offgrid,
    What size pipe did you use? Is it Schedule 40 or 80? I've been looking at the idea of sleeving a pipe inside the pipe for added strength. How high is you tower now, and could you sleeve it?
    BeachBum
     
  19. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    offgrid:

    The wind was at a gale force so probably somewhere between 38 to 60 mph.
    All of a sudden a strange screeching sound started and you could feel the energy building inside the house. This lasted for about 10 - 15 sec and then was back to the gale force storm. When we ran to look at the towers it was strange cause every time there was a lighting flash, there stood that tower all bent over and still spinning.
    That down burst of wind energy was only in one small area and just up the river about 3 km from us were 50 youth camping out in a wilderness experience Oh so fortunate that it hit us and not them !

    murray
     
  20. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Beach:

    I have done the sleeve thing with one of my towers. In fact same tower that we are talking about that got bent. The top 10 ft section was 1 1/2 in so after it got bent I slipped the wires out of harms way and used the torch to heat and straighten it again. I then slipped a section of 2 in over it rather than remove it.
    Worked out well. BUT I should have spent more time in securing the two pipes to each other because now I have what I am calling a harmonic vibration sound and I am pretty sure this is due to the two pipes. What I could have done was torch a few spaced holes through the outer 2 in as open windows to the inner pipe, then welded to each other through those holes to ensure they were solid to each other and not allow any movement causing vibration.

    I have been thinking about your pole issue and staying with the pole inside a pole thought, maybe you could take a little of Tom's winch up idea and telescope your inner pole up to your desired height. You would need a guide pole attached to the outer larger pole to place a pulley to pull / lower the inner section but it could work. Just don't know what to think about all the salt air you have to deal with, Maybe its me that is blowing too much air. Hope you find a solution though, would really like to hear how your unit works for you.
    murray
     

Share This Page