My first geared windy nation pma

Discussion in 'Post Your Photos' started by bluejay, Jun 21, 2010.

  1. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Wow, I see why they are saying you should always see 24 volts for any turbine system. We had 10-17 mph winds and watched it make 489 watts for over a hour..I watched the volts steadily rise in a range around 20 volts alot and know it wasnt from battery drain feeding the grid tie. It was cloudy and the new GTI 500w was HOT! I tried to hook into my solar GT's but they were bolted on in a 12v way and was only readin 11 volts(Half the voltage at the time).

    I have become real excited and have finally started to see some rewards for the work put in! :D

    This is only means I have to rethink the gears!!!!! :x :x :lol: :lol:
  2. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    BUT now that my 12.5 v 500 gti drained both batteries down to around 13.75. The wind is at 15 mph and its raised the voltage at 15 and is clamped it to a crawl..I turned off the GT and it is spinning like normal putting around 23 volts into the bank...So if the batteries are drained and trying to feed the grid ties its very close to a total short..too much load

    The other grid ties I see are 28-55..I want something around 20 volt bottom on a 24 volt bank..That way it doesnt drain them completely and it lets it gain speed before it senses a load... :roll: :?:
  3. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    I have tried using a bank ( 12, 24, 36, 48) to feed grid tie inverters. I have a number of 500 and one 1200 grid tie.
    I found in each case the inverter was ready to dump immediately within it V in range to the grid. There was never any storage in the bank.
    I also discovered that for example if I was using a 36 V bank, the inverter would keep drawing V and would not settle out till it reached about 26 - 27 V left in the bank..
    I did do a short write up in the forum column under grid ties and expressed my concerns on doing damage to the bank.

    Blue, I had my best success after no longer using the banks and feeding directly to inverter then to the grid.
    BUT this also required dump controls for the amount of high V in to protect the inverters.

    I used SWEA grid tie equipment to control the V in. These two pieces were not expensive.

  4. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Blue, almost forgot, both of my inverter types were the 28 - 56 V in range.
    Although one of them you are able to tune and I have one now that kicks in at 20 V.
    The SWEA type had to be tuned for either wind or solar.

  5. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    So do these SWEA grid ties also do something when the gris goes down? I seen that they start braking around 52V if I remember right. Wasnt that the $500 250w model. So 2 of them I would be in the range of just buying a windyboy or other higher end units.
    I would love to be able to afford equipment to hook directly to the grid with out batteries and also be able to have it switch to my choice of dump load on grid failure....
  6. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    the down side of those grid tie inverters is when the main grid goes down your turbine sits there doing nothing for you/. this is especially depressing if it is during a big wind. I had written in the other post that there should be some way to transfer your turbine to another source to take advantage ( such as a storage battery bank )
    The price is much better than what you posted. You can get in touch with one of our members ( Beachbum ) I believe he is now a distributor and can give you a fair price rather than off of Ebay. Or you can write to SWEA and deal directly with them.

    I did look into the Windyboy but at that time they wanted you to use a battery bank with their product and then I still needed a V in control for their inverter and electronic braking, so the Windy boy was out for me. They may have many changes by now, I know that Windy Girl has a V in rectifier that can match your desired V in. Windy Girl advertises their rectifier to complement the Windy Boy.

  7. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

  8. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Alright its has broken itself in well.not as much noticable clicking from the chain.
    We are having good wind and at 19.2 mph I ran into the basement and saw 196 watts into the grid. :D
    I am still on a 12v system and have a GT thats 20.7 bottom coming but I see now the gearing would have to be lower,its spinning like crazy and the battery buffer is reading 16+ volts..I dont care about shortening the life of the battery i am using as I will never draw from it so it is just a voltage buffer right now...I was told they will last a long time like this just the "memory" decreases.But that doesnt bother me..

    I am happy and ready for constructing the next one but if I do gear it down and step up voltage then it prolly wont trickle in low winds but put out more in high winds..From all my reading thats the catch 22 and the fine line that needs to be walked.. :ugeek: I will ponder during my relax times in the evening and look over all my data to decide what gears I will need if I do the 24v system..thinking about the 20(motor):40(blades)
  9. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Ok during the peak wind of today the battery voltage was showing 17.10 with 348 watts into the grid.The battery was warm to the touch but I was staying around incase it had issues..The weather is calling for real wind tomorrow 20-30mph with 40mph gusts. I dug the next hole after splitting wood today..went 4 foot deep for a 32 ft tower. I am going for 25 foot towers and no trees! dropped the tallest 60ft+ this weekend..Took over a hour..cut the slant then start the hinge and they slam the wedge in,,carve alittle more then slam the wedges(2). Fell right where it was suppose to finally!

    I should get the new higher voltage GT in a day or 2(Tomorrow would be great!) I will run it for a few weeks and or see if the gears need to be changed..the 2 mills in the future will be both hooked to the 2 battery 24 volt bank..I have a wind blue and the 11 black blades/hub (spinns fast as hell) but never had much amps but good volts. will add this to the bank in the future....So blessed :mrgreen:
  10. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer


    1800 pounds of total concrete 26 ft top and NEVER wires. If these towers can snap that easily than I will find another way..The turbine should tear apart before these would ever snap!!!

    I put in a second today 30 60lb bags with a few feet in the ground to..Its one hell of a footprint! 48x48x10 above ground.48" down for a tap root :mrgreen:
  11. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    That sure looks like a lot of concrete :eek:

    I dug the hole for the tracker and laid the concrete for it all by hand. It was a bitch!

    Did you do that all by hand?
  12. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Me and a cheap china made cement mixer..2 60lb bags at a time...The new one that had a 4 foot hole took 30 bags to make 1800 lbs and took about 3 hours of mixing...

    I got some 13.1 ft(wind diameter) blades coming!..Back to a 20 gear before it goes back up next week..I have to get a brass piece to mount a set of 9ft blades(sent the wrong order replacing the 10.6).I will post how I do it after I see how it needs to be enginered.

    I am mounting these directly to a windy PMA for some testing :D
  13. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    Man, I should of rented a concrete mixer. I mixed it all with a shovel!

    Watch the amps if you are going with a geared 13 foot blade set. I think you could run the risk of overheating the PMA's stator. You will definitely be OK at a continuous 35-40 amps but after that we have not done testing for overheating. I have taken the PMA up to over 50 amps with no problems but that was only for a couple of minutes. It might be fine at 50 amps but I cannot guarantee it.

    If you are going into a 24 volt bank, that will still get you over 1000 Watts (40 amps x ~27 volts).
  14. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Thats ok..I burn one up I will buy another and gear it down some!..I have changed stators in the windblue and from the videos the windy has even thicker wire than a stator with a 300rpm cuttin.. I am suprised that it makes 12v under 100..Good magnet placement and thick wire...I think we will find alot of hidden power in these units that wouldnt normally be seen with only 36" wind grabbers.. Once high resistance there isnt enough blade to push harder..

    I think I got this hub fastened to a WN pma securely and running true..They taper and so does the windy shaft..I put in a brass bussing and torqued it down. I am now drilling thru the hub and shaft to put a bolt thru also..These 9 foot blade span are identical to the larger ones just alittle narrower and shorter..I think they should spin fast and still have good torque....

    So with nice weather and UPS on time I should have the geared one and another direct drive one up by the end of next week.. :mrgreen: :ugeek:
  15. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    1800 lbs of concrete...I am so pissed,this isnt suppose to have so many failures tied to the testing..[​IMG]
  16. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Oh crap !

    Man I feel for you with all the hard work you have been doing .
    What kind of damage to the turbine and gears ?

    Bluejay, did this one come down as a result of big winds from the same direction as the other one ?
    That just looks like the big pines or highland spruce that are toppled at home after big winds.
    The amount of torque / stress that must be created at the top and multiplied to the root / base must be amazing.
  17. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    I havent checked anything as it is blowing like crazy right now....I see that they will have to be geared down more and will sacrifice some low end output. It was geared to rev up in good winds and do believe it was actually creating a lift that helped topple it...This is the original one that fell and yes the winds were from the same direction as last time...The new one had a longer and deeper "foot" before the large slab on top and believe I wont have any problems with it...

    I have a new one with all the aluminium frame made and should have(weather permiting) it up in a week or so....

    I was going to tear the fallen one apart as to replace with the better metal frame but mother nature decided to do it for me...Lost another set of $200 blades :(
  18. mark99

    mark99 WindyNation Engineer

    That can’t suck enough! I lost a tie wire and then the whole unit because of the concrete being pulled out of the ground. I found that by going deeper into the ground helped with the leverage that is produced by the wind. I also cut some ¾ inch rebar at an angle and drove them into the ground 2 or 3 feet deeper then the pour. Dude its time to think about some guide wires. The power that had to have taken should make a lot of electricity! I know you’re pissed but you’re doing good work. Have a few beers, chill then come back tomorrow and kick its butt. Good luck Mark
  19. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    A washer on the one leg broke allowing the bolt to slip thru and put all the torque of the wind on the back two legs creating a pivot point...As soon as I took the turbine frame off it lifted itself back into place! :eek: :eek: ..Prolly will weld the sections once It warms up in spring if it will lock back and is straight..

    The blades are jacked..Nose cone was fine along with the shaft and motor..The case(cover) is fine and I am already making my aluminium replacement frames...

    I will never use guide wires..I will put steel pipes as spines inside the tower frame and use more concrete if needed.


    I will be gearing it down to just enough to still spin fast for 24v and lower winds but will cut my rpm down by around half. This gearing let it fly! These blades are 2 big to let it hit those rpms..

    Need to set up a charitable donation just for all the stuff I am learning the hard way for those that follow :lol:
  20. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    by bluejay » Fri Dec 17, 2010 7:59 am

    I have decided to run really low gearing and not have to worry about those high of rpms with the 10.6 blades..I will be running a direct drive WN pma to bring the volts up in low wind as to let the geared ones only see a load in the operating range

    $600 worth of broke blades is what like one college class..hehe gotta pay for knowledge one way or another :lol:

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