Effsun 2kw Gen head 480 rpm..

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by bluejay, Sep 15, 2011.

  1. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Well we got good winds right now and here are some observations...The 24v 500's are spinning about twice as fast as the 2kw..You can tell the 2kw is under a resistance load from hitting that dc voltage of the others...This would be nice in heavy winds but I see that this will effect my output grately and would like to see the 2kw run on its own grid ties but I do not have $ to even think about doing that...Saw the biggest blip so far of 26V and 450w.. I have a feeling the natural range for the 2kw would be in the 35-45v range with a 6 gt bank...
    I am feeding two dedicated circuits now and would love to have 4 lines to feed from 18 gts and 3 2kw gen heads.

    I dont like mixing differnt voltage gen heads together because some are going to be not as efficient as they could be..

    Would love to see data from two identical gens with one month of tied voltages and one month of seperate GT's..You would need identical wind for both months so that would not happen or run 4 and collect data from each pair of two..
  2. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    I unhooked 3 GT's and the lock on volts was unleashed..gust started taking it up to 45 V and I was seeing over 1 kw output.. the more gridties,the larger the load and more locking in the voltage but you also will give up some output...

    A balancing act..already started saving for another 2kw to install next year :)
  3. TomT

    TomT WindyNation Engineer

    Thanks for the info.
  4. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Well that wasnt a good idea,,had big winds roll in and fried all my GT's...3 just needed new fuses and the other three need will need caps soldered in..The boards are not epoxied in on these,it will be very easy to replace the voltage caps,but now I see they toatally fill the bottom of the board with solder..might be tricky to get the pos and neg out...

    I see 600v gt's in my future and running a few turbines in series for it to keep the amps down,,saw wire tips glowing today! Smoke billowed out from them for 20 seconds!:(

    Battery bank (24 214amp hours with NO diode in place)..keep it drawn down to 22v..its only just to act as a voltage rergulator and will work well but will wear them out quicker..
    putting a 24v desuflator on it to keep it from buildup..
  5. TomT

    TomT WindyNation Engineer

    I bought a desolder iron to remove mine. Bought it from radio shack.
  6. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    I do not recommend more than 2 turbines or 1 true 1kw gen with the SUN-G style grid tie inverters or any other brand.To low of volts means a higher amp system and these are not made for it.
    I just burnt up the last 4 I had for my turbines from 20 + mph winds.. I guess I have to figure out how to get financing for a gt that all 3 can be ran in series and still be safe with that amperage.
    I ran the 2 500's on a 3 bank for a long time and feel the average homeowner would see no problems up till the 1 k mark...

    From another post-

    "Tom I fried my whole 22-60 bank with amps that not only fried the fuses but started to melt the posts.. One grid tie malfucntions so bad that juice flowed back from the grid sparking and tripped the breaker..​

    To many turbines connected for these entry level grid ties.. I wouldnt recommend more than a true 1kw on these no mattery the size of the bank. "​

    No more money and only could be used for heat if needed...​
    I will prolly wont be around much for a while but I will revive this when I figure out how I get to upgrade.​
  7. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Well a update already....A older friend repairs tvs boards, he looked at them and all but one(the one that had both + - hooked to) can just have the caps replaced. He said as long as I use the same 2200 rating that there is no reason we cant put a 80 or 100v volt cap as a replacement..Think of that no overvolt worries and only blown fuses!!!!!!

    I also am takin the 2 500s and running them seperate on there own sun-g's like for the whole last year..

    I am bound and determined to get the 2 kw to work with sun-g's and should of thought about just how many amps all three were producing,,were were well over 80 amps combined in 20 mph winds...
  8. leamywind1

    leamywind1 WindyNation Engineer

    Hey Blue good progress on the caps. Can you ask your friend if he can duplicate the inveter with the improvments. I was going to take one of mine to a shop to see if they can build a replica. I am going to see if i can get them made on this contenent. Any thoughts?

    Blue one more suggestion. I do not beleive those Sun G's will give you the full satisfaction you will need with your 2kw. I would advise getting one 2kw inverter that works at a higher volatge range. You may damage the stator by pusing to many amps or keep burning up inverters at your own cost. The higher voltage turbine you have the better options of inverters you will find to match. Good luck which ever route you take.
  9. windyguru

    windyguru WindyNation Expert

    That is a good idea Larry. It will not be easy but it would be great if you do it :)
  10. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    I have the same turbine , they are 56 v cut in, for me that was just too high in volts to hold back and create my watts through higher amps ! I bought two Ginlong 2000' inverters and Andy picked up one. MW sells them for $1500.00, we got ours for $550.00 per. Neither of us has our new turbines up yet so we are not able to give feedback on their performance .
  11. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    when they say the 500's and 750's are 24v,from my observations is that is the top and there isnt many volts it can produce after that... From all my testing I never seen more than 50 volts out of them and only ever overvolted the 10-28's,..
    I know I need something like a 40-120 2kw and have been getting qoutes on them...Problem is alot of the nicer ones are 100-600v and unless you are running 3 turbines it will be hard to hit that BUT they can only handle 30 amps input and 3 gens would burn that up quick..PROBLEM for a $1700 inverter.. Those would be good for the 200+v 2kw gen with thinner wire and less amps.. We have low volt high amp gens with big stator wire and the only problem I could see if the heat would actually burn thru the coating on the stator and cause a short.The wire itself is thick enough it would never overheat and melt.
  12. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    And mur you are right, you can watch it spin @ the 22v load and tell it needs to be going twice as fast to utilize all the torque of wind at that moment.It doesnt catch enough at those rpm to spin up efficiently from gusts.
  13. Andy R.

    Andy R. WindyNation Engineer

    Yeah, but Andy doesn't know what he's doing. It sure is good looking though!
  14. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Well had to drive 30 miles for 4 63v caps today but one grid tie is fine and has ran for a few hours on the small turbines(combined + 2 never overvolted ones) They didnt have 80v or 100v caps(2200uf) for testing,they are on there way from hong kong and were $$$$..

    On a side note I want to add all the sung 10-28's I have lost and couldnt repair came with a 30amp fuse and a small circuit board the terminals are attached too.They come with a 30 amp fuse CHANGE IT IMMEDIATELY and you might not melt transformers on that board making them un repaiable..

    the 22-60 suns do not have this board but should always have a 20 amp fuse in them even though they do not have this inferior board design...

    I hope all this helps you guys avoid finacial loss while doing extreme testing :D
  15. leamywind1

    leamywind1 WindyNation Engineer

    Thanks Blue, good infor on the fuses. Man we need these things made in our own back yard.
    bluejay likes this.
  16. murray2paddles

    murray2paddles WindyNation Engineer

    Good info, will change mine as soon as possible. Tried to check one of my fuses 2 weeks ago and it came apart . Seems one side was soldered solid to the terminal . Ugh !

    Also heard today from a Sun G dealer, Sun informed him that the MOSFET are weak and require being changed to an upgrade. Will try to find out tech stats on the new one.

    I do not mind buying from China BUT I am fed up with the lack of customer support / after care and how much the language barrier seems to increase when you have a product issue.

    No kidding Larry I wouldn't mind paying a little more for a product made in N America just to ensure there was some customer after care.
  17. leamywind1

    leamywind1 WindyNation Engineer

    Well let's work together and get these things made here. Blue, Mur or anyone else let's roll up oursleves and work on this. Having a GTI for low voltage turbine has been a thorn in my As# for a long time.
    Here is a start to understanding
    MOSFET testing


    Get a multimeter with a diode test range.
    Connect the meter negative to the MOSFET's source.
    Hold the MOSFET by the case or the tab if you wish, it doesn't matter if you touch the metal body but be careful not to touch the leads until you need to. Do NOT allow a MOSFET to come in contact with your clothes, plastic or plastic products, etc. because of the high static voltages it can generate.
    First touch the meter positive on to the gate.
    Now move the positive meter probe to the drain. You should get a low reading. The MOSFET's gate capacitance has been charged up by the meter and the device is turned on.
    With the meter positive still connected to the drain, touch a finger between source and gate (and drain if you wish, it doesn't matter). The gate will be discharged through your finger and the meter reading should go high, indicating a non-conducting device.

    What can cause these to fail?
    Electrical Surges
    1) Earthing System
    Surge Protectors shunt transients to the earth grounding system. A low impedance ground path, at the same potential, is critical for the surge protectors to function properly. All power systems, communication lines, grounded and ungrounded metallic objects need to be equipotentially bonded for the protection scheme to work efficiently.

    2) Underground Connection from External PV Array to Electrical Control Equipment
    If possible, the connection between the external Solar PV Array and the internal power control equipment
    should be underground or electrically shielded to limit the risk of direct lightning strikes and/or coupling.

    3) Coordinated Protection Scheme
    All available power and communication networks should be addressed with surge protection to eliminate PV system vulnerabilities. This would include the primary AC utility power supply, Inverter AC output, Inverter DC input, PV string combiner and other related data/signal lines such as RS-485, 4-20mA current loop, PT-100, RTD, and telephone modems. This all applies to a wind turbine system as well.

    A/C whole house surge prtector $40-$100.00

    surge prtector.jpg

    D/C surge/lighting protector $30-$50.00


    I have them on my system as well and that may be why i have not had any mosfet problems due to grid faliures. We install the D/C arrestor on all of our solar and wind systems on the D/C side.
  18. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

    Now its over my head :eek:..I have been talking to a few companies in china(if you call some of the broken english sentences that :D) and maybe Leamy you can explain the dif between ones with transformers(told higher amps allowed) verse ones without... I agree Leamy,,dont we need to create some jobs in this belly up country.:D
    If we can have car amplifiers that can run 100 amps then someone can make us a 25v to 100v Gt's that could handle higher amps with the right sized wire
  19. bluejay

    bluejay WindyNation Engineer

  20. leamywind1

    leamywind1 WindyNation Engineer

    Not sure what "Forget "means but i already know what a GTI is and all the qualifications for them so you can remove "Leamy" from your last post.
    It's UL or go underground to China for low volt turbines. USA has to much red tape for little plug in inverters. It's not the technology it's the politics. How we are able to buy them is beyond me.
    Transformer GTI's are becoming a thing of the past, so i read. Mosfets are used in GTI's with voltages of less then 250vdc thus allowing more amps.
    From what i have read the copper is getting to expensive to buy and so transformerless inverters are being produced. IGBT's are now being used which is a solid state type of mosfet and can also react faster to the grid regarding a volatge spikes, grid detections ect. Either way if they are made here or there they are illigal to US standards which we all know. So who cares if we can get someone over here to make them. I am not a guru on the electronics , GTI's or RE by any means, that is why i am hear but i can tell with all of my suggestions and what i have impplimated on my wind system not one of my China inverters have failed.........yet anyway. I do not think it is not always necessarly the GTI's i think it is more on how they are being used. These inverters are more complex then they make them out to be when using them for wind. There are to many considerations, trial, and many errors involved for the average person. The problem is the avgerage person does not even relize the considerations until it is to late. That is why i have posted all of my findings on this forum. To "Help" not to Forget" . I hope my explination that you asked for was to your satisfaction. Please feel free to add or correct me as i am always looking for information on RE.
    Good luck with your system.:)

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